Should drugs be legalized?

[krotch]

No. Revenue doesn't make up for the possibility of misuse. Many of the hardcore drugs can cause addiction the first time it's used. Imagine if it were legal. A lot of ppl who would have never tried drugs might decide to try. It's one quick way to fizuck the shiat out of your economy. Drugs have stayed out of many ppl's hands simply cause of the fact that it's illegal and hard to get. If everyone's addicted to drugs and blowing every ounce of cash to sponsor their addiction, what good is the revenue?

As for medicine, that's strictly monitored. When was the last time you've seen a doctor hand a syringe and a bottle of morphine to someone and tell them,"3 shots a day" and let them take it home with them? Even if they did, how easy would it be to get more if they do become addicted to morphine?

Also different drugs have different effects. Even if you used them in a "special place," when you leave do the hallucinations simply stop? Will these coffee shop places or whatever hold the person until they are back to normal? This can also make it hella easier to kill someone. Cause someone to OD while they are high. Slip them more speed, some coke, or acid. They'll never know, they were too high.

I feel it'd be a very bad idea to legalize every single drug. Might as well give everyone nukes too.

[Haruharu Haruko]

Now, I thought i'd try and start a debate on this. What do you think about the legalization of drugs? and I don't mean the legalization of cannabis, i mean the legalization of all drugs. Now, at first you may think this idea is completely absurd, but there's acctually a very good argument for the legalization of drugs...

If all drugs were legalized, the government could supervise it's distribution, and it could tax it. This would be taking money straight out of the black market, and as the drugs trade is the 3rd largest trade in the world (after #1 oil. and #2 arms trade.) So the government would have a massive new revenue, which they could use for schools and hospitals and such. Also, the drugs would be clean and cut correctly, so there would be less deaths because of overdosing, as the government would be supplying the correct ammount. The impact this would have on crime would also be phenomenal, organized crime would have lost its biggest money maker, and there would be no drug dealers to kill people....

Now, i'm just proposing this because i think it's an interesting argument, what do you think?

[Chichio]

Hmm...intresting yes. But in a way you are right. If drugs were legal, the drug dealers would not get money which very often goes to mafia/yakuza/and other gangs like that. And if it would be legal, the motivation for people trying it out would become smaller, as everyone knows forbidden things are the best things to do. At least that is right for many people in the world. What I do not understand in the current world, other drugs are legal, like nicotine, alcohol and the all drugs in medicine. What makes them different? Nothing, they are still drugs, maybe little less harmfull, but it is your life not someone else. You shoul have the right to decide what you eat/drink/smoke.

If drugs would be legalized, there could be special places where you can use them, so that you can't do harm to others. Like the coffee-shops in Amsterdam. They sell drugs there, but you are not allowed to take them out of there. One has to use them in there. I think that isa good idea, as it makes smoking them legal in a way, but still in a way that keeps other people in safe.

As everyone know, some of the "hard" drugs are used in medicine, like morphium. What makes that more legal than using it without needing morphium as a pain killer, it has only been made little differently. That does not make sense to me, if it is illegel to use it on your own time it should be illegal to use it as a medicine as well.

Oh and if someone thinks that I smoke/take drugs or anything like that. I have never even smoke a cigaret, alcohol tastes good with food or if it is a drink. I have never taken a drug, besides my asthma medicine.

[Garven]

The idea is a very promising one, and one i've heard before. Quick frankly, I agree right along with it. Unfortunately the biggest hurdles would be putting this plan into action, and how the general public would react to it (or I guess getting enough people to think about it, revise the plan blah blah to get it to the attention of the higher ups to seriously consider it). Although i'm sure there are a lot of level-headed people out there and can think about this and go, "Hey! That thar issn' a bad idear!" Then we'd tune to the news to the reports of the Angery Mothers Union throwing protests to 'protect our children' and what-not.

That area-for-drug-use is an interesting idea, but I'd sure hate to work at a place like that as security or something.

[Adolf Hitler]

Drugs should not be legalized. I think that medical marijoina is OK but only if it is needed, like if the person is really in pain or suffering. But that can be abused too, one of my friend gets his weed from places that hand out medical marijona but he doesent even have a script.
Also, "hard" drugs like PCP, Extacy, shrooms should NOT be allowed because they could cause brain damage and make people dangerous to themselves and others. Not unlike alcohol, but you need a lot of it to make you really dangerous and by then you should have passed out or be too disoriented to do anything.

[Maria Renard]

prozac is a drug? :D

Gao~!

[Haruharu Haruko]

Firstly, I hope nobody gets hostile while i'm proposing this idea. It's just an idea.

You'd have less deaths because the drugs would be set out in the right dosages, and they'd also have all the crap taken out that's in drugs sold on the street (such as talcom powder in cocaine), so they'd be safer then the way they are now. Also, alot of the way it's recieved by the public would depend on the way the government distributes it. The ideal would be to not promote drugs at all, and acctually provide helplines and adverts against the use of drugs, but then still provide the facillities to buy and use them for those who are already addicted.

also, did you know that many hardcore drugs are almost impossible to die from when they are cut correctly and given in the right dosages. Most of the time people who use drugs OD because of all the crap that's been put in with the drugs they're taking.

something to contemplate yes? :p

[havok]

Wrong....it is only decriminiced(is that the world in English?)So basically it is illegal but the police will not do anything as long as you do not have more than 10g of cannabis with you. After that the police will do something against it. It is just seen as acceptable by the police, besides few police officers maybe. That is what I have heard, never read the law or asked the police, but it makes sense for me...so if you have something that states otherwise, I will believe, but till than I stay by this what I have heard/read.


My parents actually live in the Netherlands and I have been visiting twice a year for a couple years. The actual law is that they legalized what they consider "soft drugs". That only includes marijuana and hallucinogenic mushrooms. You can carry around up to 5 grams of marijuana at a time for personal use(nobody is going to check you anyways), its legal to grow it, but you cant sell or supply it without a proper permit. I dont know what the law is on the shrooms though.

[krotch]

Ya, but a number of drugs are make from crap and nothing else. Methacatinone (cat) for one. One of it's ingredients is battery acid. Without it, it's not cat. And right doses? Uh, exactly how are you going to do that? You think a drug addict is going to care about right doses? They'd sooner rob the "special places" to get a higher amount. Course, if drugs were legal, I'm sure the number of addicts would skyrocket.

Ppl get alcohol poisoning from well...alcohol and that's perfectly legal. Also this revenue from taxing drugs is essentially lost by creating helplines, adverts, programs to help addicts, law enforcement, and so forth. Where's the benefit here? The government already gets money from drugs. Everything that's confiscated is taken and used to fight the drug wars.

Did you know that ppl slowly become tolerant to drugs, thus causing them to take higher dosages, thus ODing? Ppl don't OD from crap that's in drugs. It's from taking too much. That's why they call it overdosing.

The world is not a perfect place and your ideals would be far from perfect if implemented. Alcohol is perfectly legal, so explain why ppl die from alcohol poisoning, drunking driving, etc. There's bars for ppl to drink it, yet ppl still die. The bartender cuts ppl off (right doses), yet ppl still die. Beer is regulated in it's manufacture, yet ppl still die. There are helplines and adverts, yet ppl still die.

[maohayato]

If drugs would be legalized, there could be special places where you can use them, so that you can't do harm to others. Like the coffee-shops in Amsterdam. They sell drugs there, but you are not allowed to take them out of there. One has to use them in there. I think that isa good idea, as it makes smoking them legal in a way, but still in a way that keeps other people in safe.



you are wrong. in Amsterdam and anywhere else in the Netherlands you can take your cannabis out of the coffeeshop. every citizen is allowed to own cannabis up to a certain amount of weight, don't remember anymore how much but its very small. this is considered for personal use, any amount over that is considered as dealing and you are arrested.

[Chichio]

you are wrong. in Amsterdam and anywhere else in the Netherlands you can take your cannabis out of the coffeeshop. every citizen is allowed to own cannabis up to a certain amount of weight, don't remember anymore how much but its very small. this is considered for personal use, any amount over that is considered as dealing and you are arrested.
Wrong....it is only decriminiced(is that the world in English?)So basically it is illegal but the police will not do anything as long as you do not have more than 10g of cannabis with you. After that the police will do something against it. It is just seen as acceptable by the police, besides few police officers maybe. That is what I have heard, never read the law or asked the police, but it makes sense for me...so if you have something that states otherwise, I will believe, but till than I stay by this what I have heard/read.

[Knifes]

[COLOR=Navy]Interesting idea.... but what it comes down to it's the fight of Morality vs. Economics....

And in this day and age...we're seriously screwing up whatever "values" we have left (although it could be argued that "no values" is a "value" :D:P) But anywho... being a addicting a to certain drug... say heroin.. can really mess anyone within five years. (no kidding right? :D:P) (and yes my exp. does serve me well by knowing a guy <-- currently in a hospital) Most gov'ts mainly make it illegal because it simply screws up the lives of many. I mean most countries would want to have people over 30 yrs old :) (it makes them look good for crying out loud :D:p) But seriously even though the benefits may look good by saving money... another way of thinking is how many custom officials, police, and the people who have a job to prevent drugs from comin

[Lesdude]

To get back on track :P
Should drugs be legalized
*drunk high school reaction*
Yeah dude!!! Woooo~~~ Let's get wasted! \o/ Live you life to the fullest! \o/ Woooo~~~:D :D :D :D .... -_-

*Lesdude responds*
Wooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo~~~

Well... I don't really know everything about drugs and stuff, but I go out almost every weekend where people are smoking canabis... (to make things clear... I have never smoked canabis before :D Nor do I smoke :D *croud goes wild \o/*) This creates a really strong scent... which is filtered by the

[maohayato]

Wrong....it is only decriminiced(is that the world in English?)So basically it is illegal but the police will not do anything as long as you do not have more than 10g of cannabis with you. After that the police will do something against it. It is just seen as acceptable by the police, besides few police officers maybe. That is what I have heard, never read the law or asked the police, but it makes sense for me...so if you have something that states otherwise, I will believe, but till than I stay by this what I have heard/read.

I live in the netherlands, it is not illegal to own cananbis for personal use. this personal use is defined in the amount of weight.

please refrain from making statements about the laws and drugpolicy of the netherlands if you do not live there. thank you.

[Haruharu Haruko]

The fact is that there will always be people who take drugs, and those people are fueling the black market. And just because something becomes legal does not mean that more people will use it....


Did you know that ppl slowly become tolerant to drugs, thus causing them to take higher dosages, thus ODing? Ppl don't OD from crap that's in drugs. It's from taking too much. That's why they call it overdosing

actually, the reason why most people OD is because a drug dealer happens to stumble across quite a large and strong batch of heroin or whatever, and they try to get rid of it quickly because they don't want to be caught. so they sell it off cheap and the junkies who use it, use the same amount they always do, but because the drugs they are taking are stronger they OD. It happens all the time. Some strong drugs hit the streets and a bunch of kids die because of it. At least if the government had control this wouldn't happen...

[Chichio]

I live in the netherlands, it is not illegal to own cananbis for personal use. this personal use is defined in the amount of weight.

please refrain from making statements about the laws and drugpolicy of the netherlands if you do not live there. thank you.
I never said anything about personal use, did I? Personal use is something different from taking it with you outside of your own appartement/coffee-shops.

" But has formal written policy of nonenforcement" That says it is not legal, but one does not do anything against it unless you have more than 5g of cannabis with you. Got that with little searching here: http://ist-socrates.berkeley.edu/~maccoun/DWH_briefing/tsld022.htm

http://www.minbuza.nl/default.asp?CMS_TCP=tcpAsset&id=175A6D3F70164607A386D43B61DC135FX2X42819X14 there is some more information about drugs being legal in Netherlands. This is a quote from that PDF: A2 Are drugs legal in the Netherlands?
No. Contrary to what is commonly believed abroad, all drugs are forbidden in the Netherlands. Coffee shops may sell 5 grams of cannabis, under strict conditions (see B3), without facing prosecution and no legal action if taken for possession of small quantities of drugs for personal use (see B10). It is an offence to:
-produce
-possess
-sell
-import or export
either hard drugs or cannabis
It is not an offence to use drugs (see A4)

As you can clearly see this states all drugs are illegal in Netherlands, so I was right before, and not stating something I did not knew of. Satificed?

Oh and it took about 3 minutes of my life to check this out...and i really recommend you to read that second page to find out about the laws in your own country. Oh and I think it is quite rude to say something like that without showing any proves to state your words.

And you living in the Netherland is no argument at all. Who ever said I would not have lived there? Or have studied the law of Netherlands. And it is surprising how many people do not know the laws of the land they live in.

[Karis Fra Mauro]

I'm perfectly fine with drugs being legalized. A big chunk of the arguments against doing so spring from a basic misunderstanding. I goes along the lines of "drugs are bad because of all the crime associated with them". People neglect to separate the harm that arises from drugs from the harm that arises from the criminalization of drugs. Think about it. If you outlawed chocolate tomorrow, in no time at all you'd have chocolate drive by shootings, people dying because of bad chocolate, organized crime taking over chocolate trafficing, people getting kneecapped because they were dealing chocolate in the wrong turf, and so on. Anyway it's only a matter of time before people come to their senses and decriminalize stuff. Prohibition is mostly an embarrassing holdover from a judao-christian... Wait how do I spell that? Where's my dictionary, dang... Okay, let's say holdover from bible-freak times. Thats sort of perspective is becoming less relevant every day after all. You think Catholocism is gonna win many converts from appointing a former hitler youth as pope? Probably not.

[Mai Tokiha]

Making all drugs legal would be a damn bad idea. Quite a lot of people would start taking drugs just out of curiosity, and with it being legal then, nothing would stop them. Most hard drugs however make addicted already the first time you take it, so the number of drug addicts would rise immensely. The associated criminality would probably also rise immensely, since all the drug addicts would need to get enough money for their addiction. Also, the money spent by the drug addicts couldn't be spent in the normal economy anymore, so there would be a huge economy crisis. Since the drug addicts need an ever higher dose for their fix, overdosing would be inevitable eventually, and the number of drug deaths would also rise immensely.

[chompy]

IMHO nothing should be illegal.

no point trying to challenge me. i am already firmly of the belief that being punished for ANYTHING is not right. no laws. no anything that gets in the way of existence.

:p

so yes. all control drugs should be freely available WITHOUT you being f'd in the a by "the man"

peace out campers.

[zerebubuth]

yeah drugs should be freed , freed from humans that is . misusing nature is only a refuge to those who have nothing better to do than lionizing their bodies

[SntCamus]

I really dont care if drugs are legalized or not. I dont do drugs so i could care less if they are legal or not.

Bueno Bye.

[roc69x]

If people want to use drugs, they wild find a way to get the money (stealing, prostitution, aggravated robbery). If they were allowed the goverment could check for purity and prevent overdoses. Actually forget about what I said, all those damm hippie Junkies should move to canada or amsterdam where they have no real enforcement and live their acid dreams. Maybe the goverment could fund the trip, they already use up the welfare, clog up the homeless shelter, and are worthless pieces of trash.

[Lekz]

in my opinion, i don't think they should legalize it but that doesn't matter.

legalizing drugs in America isn't going to happen cause of the fact that the government spent billions of dollars and lives fighting against drugs for longer then some of us have been alive. they don't want the public to have a reason to call them hypocrites (which they are anyways). another reason why i don't think its going to happen is cause a large portion of Americans have an addictive personality. yea i'm sure a lot of people that are doing drugs right now will most likely stop cause its no longer the forbidden fruit but there will always be death by ODing and accidents cause by intoxication.

the Netherlands someone always brings that up. which is good to bring up but its another country its a different culture. Culture can make a whole lot of difference between two nations. Culture is based on how people are raised, treated, and tradition. that alone makes a lot of difference in a person and how he reacts to everything.

well i hope that helps. Good discussion btw

[krotch]

The fact is that there will always be people who take drugs, and those people are fueling the black market. And just because something becomes legal does not mean that more people will use it....

It doesn't mean more ppl will use it. It also can mean more ppl will use it. It's a higher possibility that more ppl will use it, then not.



actually, the reason why most people OD is because a drug dealer happens to stumble across quite a large and strong batch of heroin or whatever, and they try to get rid of it quickly because they don't want to be caught. so they sell it off cheap and the junkies who use it, use the same amount they always do, but because the drugs they are taking are stronger they OD. It happens all the time. Some strong drugs hit the streets and a bunch of kids die because of it. At least if the government had control this wouldn't happen...


You know this cause? I went through Criminology and Law Enforcement class. I also worked with local Law Enforcement for 2 years. I also did a 30 page report on drugs.

Most ppl who OD aren't little kids, it's the longer time users. Junkies don't always use the same amount they always do. The body becomes tolerant to drugs. It's a known fact, so they increase the amount they use. Eventually, they'll increase it to the point of ODing.


IMHO nothing should be illegal.
no point trying to challenge me. i am already firmly of the belief that being punished for ANYTHING is not right. no laws. no anything that gets in the way of existence.
so yes. all control drugs should be freely available WITHOUT you being f'd in the a by "the man"
peace out campers.


So I shouldn't get punished if I cut off your legs and your fingers?

[chompy]

So I shouldn't get punished if I cut off your legs and your fingers?

no.

i apoloogise if this seems irrational, but i don't believe in vengeance...

to quote a great man (and one who almost summed up my feelings exactly..)

"absolute justice is attained by the supression of all contradiction. therefore it destroys freedom.."
-Albert Camus

i wouldn't reccomend you try cutting off my legs and fingers though. :p

laws and punishments are ridiculous. we are all born wet and naked, so what makes person A capable of exacting control over person B, while persons C-Z make sure B doesn't resist....

[krotch]

Uh, that last sentence doesn't make much sense. It's more like...

Persons A-G decided to protect persons A-Z with laws. They allow persons A-Z to come forth and let their voices be heard, so that new ways of protecting A-Z can be made.

Anyways, essentially what you say in your last line is that all religion are ridiculous, cause every form of religions contains some type of law and punishment, every country is ridiculous for having laws and punishments, every school, every form of society to date.

I also don't consider Albert Camus to be a great man. Just a moron amongst many. Wrote about the wrongs of the world and did absolutely nothing to better it. Well can't expect too much out of the French.

Sorry if I happen to offend any French ppl.

[w w]

Always an interesting question. It's like abortion, really a gray area hard to commit on one side or the other.

It's anyone's guess as to how the increase in drug related deaths and the decrease in drug law-related deaths would balance out.
I'd say a net gain (to a reasonable extent) is worth the freedom as ultimately most of those deaths are a result of voluntary involvement. There's no end in sight if you have the state intervene every time a few high schoolers fail to demonstrate a little personal responsibility. Same general approach I take to gun control.

You also have to consider the intangible consequences. Something like marijuana prohibition is so widely disregarded I think it seriously undermines respect for the law and validity of the social contract in general. MJ is the first forray into "real" crime for most people, and at that point it's very common to adopt a broader "if I can get away with it then it's legal" attitude.
A certain Einstein quote comes to mind.

Then there's the racial element to think about. White drug-related jailtime : black drug-related jail time is grossly disproportionate to white use : black use. Some consider drug laws as a way to control the black community, such as during the civil rights movement. Just something to consider.


On the other hand you have drugs like meth that do seriously and regularly endanger people unconnected to the user. This does indeed throw a monkey wrench into the situation.

Anyway, it's just idle speculation obviously. There's simply too much money flowing through the prison system, abolishing drug laws would effectively empty it out. See: P-I complex (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prison-industrial_complex)




There's definitely something to what Haruko is saying in this little side argument about cause of death. People are usually too lazy to go half-barrel on H they're unfamiliar with, resulting in unpleasant consequences if it isn't cut the way they're used to.
Additionally, as mentioned, you have the total nonregulation of adulterants. About a year ago we had what's affectionately known as the 'the scourge' pop up around here, which is H cut with paracetamol and industrial drain cleaner. Not exactly the best stuff to get jammed with.
Both of these problems would be drastically reduced with just a little regulation.

At least in my demographic (lower-middle class urbanites) these are far more common than ODing simply due to an extreme tolerance buildup. You really have to be a hack to OD on any opiate, including heroin, even when you're totally strung out. The other "classic" "hard" drugs aren't much different. Cocaine for example is about the most benign drug you can imagine, contrary to the popular perception. The only thing it's a danger to is your wallet.
Maybe it's different out in the slums or suburbia, I don't know. Suburban kids are all into 2-CB and other designer drugs these days which are much more dose-sensitive. Not to mention they're generally dumbasses when it comes to drug use.




IMHO nothing should be illegal.

no point trying to challenge me. i am already firmly of the belief that being punished for ANYTHING is not right. no laws. no anything that gets in the way of existence.

:p

so yes. all control drugs should be freely available WITHOUT you being f'd in the a by "the man"

peace out campers.
Hahahaha




I also don't consider Albert Camus to be a great man. Just a moron amongst many. Wrote about the wrongs of the world and did absolutely nothing to better it. Well can't expect too much out of the French.

Sorry if I happen to offend any French ppl.

Haha, I'm French and I'm not offended. Camus was a crackpot.

[Crys]

I used to sway towards the side of legalization of marijuana, but now, even THAT'S changed, after I've realized how many idiots in this country confuse the concept of legal with the concepts of safe/right/moral/normal and stuff like that. A lot of people believe (the more liberal ones, at least) that if the government says it's okay, then there's absolutely nothing wrong with it and you should take advantage of it to the fullest extent. I already have drunk rednecks driving around my town (Lucky I ship out for USAF in a month). The last thing we need is drunk AND high rednecks driving around at all hours of the day.

People say that legalization would kill the market. They seriously overestimate this country's population. When you consider how popular rap music has become in recent years, legalization would make marijuana into a billion-dollar business. Although it would be a good method of separating the wheat from the chaff, in certain parts of the country, it could do more harm than good.

[Haruharu Haruko]

There's definitely something to what Haruko is saying in this little side argument about cause of death. People are usually too lazy to go half-barrel on H they're unfamiliar with, resulting in unpleasant consequences if it isn't cut the way they're used to.
Additionally, as mentioned, you have the total nonregulation of adulterants. About a year ago we had what's affectionately known as the 'the scourge' pop up around here, which is H cut with paracetamol and industrial drain cleaner. Not exactly the best stuff to get jammed with.
Both of these problems would be drastically reduced with just a little regulation.

At least in my demographic (lower-middle class urbanites) these are far more common than ODing simply due to an extreme tolerance buildup. You really have to be a hack to OD on any opiate, including heroin, even when you're totally strung out. The other "classic" "hard" drugs aren't much different. Cocaine for example is about the most benign drug you can imagine, contrary to the popular perception. The only thing it's a danger to is your wallet.
Maybe it's different out in the slums or suburbia, I don't know. Suburban kids are all into 2-CB and other designer drugs these days which are much more dose-sensitive. Not to mention they're generally dumbasses when it comes to drug use

Thanks for the support ww, and this is exactly what i was going to get at next. There are big misconceptions about "hard" drugs, and many of them it's incredibly hard to OD on if they're pure. What people die on is the crap that the drugs are cut with, if this was regulated i believe that drug-related deaths would fall....

The only big problem with legalizing drugs would be if they became socially accepted as a whole, like alcohol is. The most dangerous drug on the world today is alcohol, simply because it's socially accepted and society has this binge drinking menatllity that is seriously f***ing up the youth of this country (U.K.). There are more deaths due to alcohol then any other, and it costs the government more money then hard drug abuse does. The ideal would be to regulate drugs and have them controlled by the government, yet try to keep them socially undesirable in the eyes of the public. As soon as they were excepted by the public on a national level I think we'd have problems....

[krotch]

(Lucky I ship out for USAF in a month).

Just a tip. When you roll out to MEPS, get plenty of sleep. Get sleep on the plane ride too. They'll keep you up when you get to Lackland.

I arrived at Lackland around 9 pm. They did give us a nap at around 10 am the next day. About 30 - 40 mins. Then actual sleep at like 9 pm.

[Crys]

Already been to MEPS once. Had to take the DLAB. Hell, I should start an Armed Services thread if there isn't one already (and I think there is; it might be dead, though)

[krotch]

You'll go to MEPS before you head out to Lackland. They'll give you a nice 30 dollar coupon for food on your way to Lackland (depending where you're leaving from.)

[Kalis]

personally, I think legalization of drugs should depend on its effect, such as whether it can ruin a person's life.
Alcohol is legal, and honestly, caffeine is incredibly addictive. And let's not go into nicotine.
In simpler words, I do think that marijuana should be legalized, although harder drugs should not.

I did do research on marijuana (I used to blaze, but I quit because I noticed how it affected my lung capacity), and research shows the addictive factor was less than alcohol, and the side effects (which only occur if you smoke daily, such as lower memorization skills, intelligence, etc.) are temporary assuming you can stop. It's definitely not the evil crazy hallucinogen that most Americans believe it to be.

[n00bonastick]

I did do research on marijuana (I used to blaze, but I quit because I noticed how it affected my lung capacity), and research shows the addictive factor was less than alcohol, and the side effects (which only occur if you smoke daily, such as lower memorization skills, intelligence, etc.) are temporary assuming you can stop. It's definitely not the evil crazy hallucinogen that most Americans believe it to be.


Marijuana lowering memorization skills? .. what are you babbling about?.
I r the intelligent one when it comes to knowing what Marijuana does to joo.
and i never forget anything. ... nothing at all!! ... I .. wait a min. what was i gonna say again?... * goes off and smokes a joint * ;) :D

[Haruharu Haruko]

personally, I think legalization of drugs should depend on its effect, such as whether it can ruin a person's life.
Alcohol is legal, and honestly, caffeine is incredibly addictive. And let's not go into nicotine.
In simpler words, I do think that marijuana should be legalized, although harder drugs should not.

I did do research on marijuana (I used to blaze, but I quit because I noticed how it affected my lung capacity), and research shows the addictive factor was less than alcohol, and the side effects (which only occur if you smoke daily, such as lower memorization skills, intelligence, etc.) are temporary assuming you can stop. It's definitely not the evil crazy hallucinogen that most Americans believe it to be.

I would probably say that even if marijuana was socially accepted today it would not be as dangerous as alcohol. Alcohol is a depressant so it leads to violent anti-social behaviour amoung some people, and people die every weekend from drunken fights or alcohol poisoning. At least many other drugs don't have that same effect, and cause harm only to the user, alcohol causes harm to others. The reason that makes alcohol dangerous is it's social acceptance, and if hard core drugs were socially accepted i think there would be bigger problems then alcohol.

The reason I started this thread was because i thought it was interesting topic to debate, and i think you can see the plusses of legalizing drugs and it's not about money, this is about trying to reduce the people who die because of drug abuse. I do believe that the ammount of people who die would be reduced, as the actual ammount of people who OD through taking too much is small, normally people die because of what it's cut with.

[charliemurphy]

in the words of bob marley and peter tosh legalize it!

[Avychan]

Doesn't matter, if people want to get high, people will get high. Personally, I don't see how someone can preach morality about not smoking weed and then go get drunk over the weekend, or smoke cigarettes. I just think alcohol and marijuana should be treated equally, since they have equal effects on your body. Though, honestly, I'd rather just see alcohol made illegal rather than any other drugs legalised.

[Omega-Poot]

Legalize them.

Will they be misused? Yes. Will a good number of people die who wouldn't have if they hadn't been legalized? Also, very yes. Legalizing drugs, making them cheaper from mass professional production and more exposed from better advertisement will cause drug-related deaths to increase, while drug-related crimes decrease, with dealers out of business and fewer offenses needed to bankroll a habit. Also, since drug use isn't a crime, far fewer people in jail because of drug-related offenses. People dumb enough to get hooked will handily kill themselves by getting addicted and throwing their life away on a cheap chemical high.

Legalize this stuff in the name of personal freedom, because people are free to throw their life away.

At the same time, anyone suffering from drug-related health problems shall be last on the list of any medical center. Bad liver from drinking? The guy with Wilson's disease is before you for a transplant. Teeth rotting out from meth? The dentist will see you in a month; he's got kids addicted to sugar to attend to.

People should not restrict other people's right to victimize themselves. While I'd like to see drugs legalized, public intoxication, at which point you become a hazard to others, or any interpersonal crime commited while intoxicated, should be considered grounds for manditory jail-time, as well as an extended sentence.

But hey, think of all the money we'd save on rehab centers, methadone clinics, long-term healthcare for junkies, and Law Enforcement expenses! Considering how many millions, or perhaps billions, that would amount too, our government could spend it on legislation to build roads, maintain (now drug-filled) schools, etc. etc.

Yes. Please legalize this filthy, disgusting, distructive habit that tears families apart, kills children and adults alike, and sends people's lives into a hole of unmitigated filth and self-loathing.

No, seriously.

[Shybal Noom]

lol
ive heard 2 jokes about this... wanna hear? il tell you anyways!
first one was... that all drugs should be legalized... but you must get them at the DMV...
lol
"shit, theres a line again! forget this im going straight! i aint spending 3 or more hours in line!"
lol
the second one was that all drugs should be legalized, but you must go to the pharmacy to get them... you spend EVEN more money and go broke sooner!
lol

-4 lol's in this post-

[Kalis]

n00bonastick:
yea. It's supposed to decrease reaction time and such too. All temporary however, and disappears a few months after you quit. It was also only detected in "chronic smokers" (those who smoke daily). Casual smokers are not affected.
I'm sure you can find the study. I found it on the net, on an appropriate site (I think it was the US government site. In general, I don't trust sites which are "pro drugs" or "anti-drugs" unless they're actual academic studies).

edit:
actually this link seems to be pretty accurate on the effects of marijuana.
http://www.askmen.com/sports/health/20_mens_health.html

Haruharu Haruko:
agreed :) Alcohol is far more harmful than marijuana.
The simple fact is that nobody has ever died from marijuana OD. For it to be lethal, you have to take 40 000 times the amount you take to get high. Plus, if you "over-toke", you feel incredibly sleepy and have to go to sleep.

I have friends who did 3 "24 hour sessions" in a week (yes, they're really hardcore blazers). They were perfectly fine and able to function. And they can definitely go without weed (they have for weeks every now and then). But in generally, they prefer to blaze because they see no reason to stop. They're having fun and they're not harming anyone.

When you compare this to the numbers who are hospitalized or die because of alcohol... :: shrugs ::

edit 2:
Oh note also that if you smoke weed out of a vapouriser, or eat it (e.g. weed brownies) it's not harmful at all, except for the intelligence and reaction time issues (which are temporary effects which last as long as you blaze).

Certainly you avoid the whole cancer and lung problems issue, which is the real problem with smoking weed (and the reason I quit).

For cons, vapourisers lead to a different "high" which is not as fun. Weed brownies are hard to control the amount you take in, and can easily lead to getting yourself too high and having a bad trip. This is especially true since it takes roughly an hour for the THC to spread through you. Not to mention that making brownies is just annoying (preparing the weed properly to get the THC, etc).

Basically, blazing is the easiest, most fun, and most harmful.
Vapourizers are the safe, but not as fun at all.
Directly ingesting food is safe, but requires preparation, and is hard to control the amount you ingest.

[xcalibro]

well i think if drugs is legalized then it will make drugs cheaper and by that make the crimanals that are now filling there pockets with it (to buy weapons and so or prostitution) having to stop there sell or at least they will be making less profit so they have less money for their crimanal activities.

[Neo Zeed]

Personally... I'm anti-drug myself. You won't see me taking any because I don't believe in them. I just find the thought of needing to induce a chemical high to be totally wrong. If you need a high then go do something fun... that's my thought anyways.

As for the drugs being legalized though. I think they should be. It'd greatly reduce the crime rates that result from this phony "war on drugs" which happens to grow the drug trade every year instead of combat it. Isn't it funny how the big columbian drug lords practically never seem to go down (even though they should be easier to surveil then try to get all the low level street thugs). Also it's my opinion that if someone wants to fry themself... who am I to stop them?

[fo0d]

I don't take drugs and i dont encourage anyone else to do so. But maybe its becuase of the numerous lessons/talk/societal morals about drugs that i have developed a barrier to it. No, im sure it is.

But in this world we live in now, no one is free to do anything. If one does something, another person will be affected. Over the years, the progress of human have move from individuals to collectives, thus society. Anything that becomes a threat to a society, will have the government take drastic measure to deal with it, even to strip away the freedom of those individuals. Maybe im straying off the point.

Legalize drugs. They may have vile effects. Is it wrong if one person makes himself enjoy/suffer? Is it wrong that your intoxication will hurt others around you?

Illegal drugs. No matter how much effort any human/organization prevent the constant flow of drug traffic, it can never be stopped. People have been stripped away from it, leading to severe disciplin malfunction. People will do anything just to get it. They would steal, kill, whatever horrible things you think about. How does this differ when drugs are legalized? The only difference is that, it just maybe worse!

[einergizer]

one word, no!! if it's just for fun. but for medical purposes then yes. :cool:

[w w]

Quite a bit of disdain for users between this and the "your anti-drug" topic. I'm a little surprised actually, considering the nature of this site.

I suppose I should offer to satisfy any curiosities on the subject, since it seems most of you haven't had much exposure to this sort of thing. Maybe you've wondered about the motivation, or the differences between the US and European drug cultures, or just the feeling of diamorphine hitting your blood. Or if you ever simply wanted to rag on a junkie lowlife without fear of reprisal then I'm your man :D
Long time involvement on both sides of the Atlantic (mainly Philly, Chicago and Paris) both recreationally and commercially, so I'll probably be able to give you a reasonably informed answer to anything you throw me.

Doubt I'll get much of a response, but I figure it's my duty to "rep" my candyman compatriots where they're given a bad name ;)

[Alkarl]

Yes, but those who pass out because of it should get no medical attention. Less dumb asses, and less overpopulation.

[DarkDweller]

i dont think it should be legalized just think of all the junkies we'll be having on our hands if that happens. No i think it is wrong, well only have alot of problems and what not. If you need some sort of drug it must be because you are sick have some sort of dicease and the doctor gave you a prescription of some sort then ok use em otherwise just leave drugs alone its just gonna mess you up over the long run some even over a short term

[HFJuon]

This too came up in my moral hazard search. Strange.

Drugs should not legalized because history tells us that by & large drug users are irresponsible. Whether it be illegal drugs or legal ones like tobacco & alcohol. No effort of regulation can guarantee responsible drug use. If you were to experiment with the concept of say legalizing pot then you must accompany that with the stiffest penalties
immaginable for damages to persons or property resulting from irresponsible usage.

If you were to experiment with the concept it would be best to do so on a small scale.
Maybe a municipality of say 50,000 persons & grow it in size doubling each time.

[zhxiate]

All drugs should be legalized, and people should be educated. I think its possible to use almost anything recreationally and live a fairly good life. I just have my rule "too much of anything is bad for you". I also know its just ingorance that keeps Marijuana illegal, its probably the safest drug of all. Its your choice to put into your body whatever you want, live whatever way you want to live. What laws do is make people think that there is only a certain way of living a good life when there is no certain way. All we as humans humans is seek pleasure and avoid pain, why take away some of our pleasures.

I've learned more about the world, more about myself, more about my brain during acid trips then I have learned in the first 19 years of my life. I finally learned why I'm here, why everything is how it is. I think everyone should drop acid at least once in their life.

[Phlogistic]

I used to agree with the idea of legalization of drugs. But now I've changed considerably. If smoking tobacco is bad, anything else is worse. Though I'm told that those with far left political views such as I generally support the legalization of marijuana, I feel that to be for the banning of cigarettes (which I am) and to be for the legalization of marijuana at the same time would be hypocritical.

[HFJuon]

I used to agree with the idea of legalization of drugs. But now I've changed considerably. If smoking tobacco is bad, anything else is worse. Though I'm told that those with far left political views such as I generally support the legalization of marijuana, I feel that to be for the banning of cigarettes (which I am) and to be for the legalization of marijuana at the same time would be hypocritical.

Your reference to cigarettes brings up another very important point: the cost of healthcare in supporting such drug use. Just because a drug can be used responsibly by some doesn't mean it will be by most. The funniest thing about the tobacco industry suits & settlements is that they didn't change a thing!
The quanity of cigarettes being bought & sold continues to increase world wide.

That's despite the surgeon general's warning & as much education as one can handle. Hollywood itself continues to glamorize smoking. Which is why again I say if you want to experiment with the concept do it on a small scale. Reality will decide whether it is a reasonable thing to do.

[Neo Zeed]

Yesterday I was reminded of an example perfectly suited to this topic... Prohibition (it is the same issue). The illegalization of a susbstance basically creates a huge blackmarket. I believe Prohibition is the perfect model to show that the war on drugs doesn't work (just like the war on alcohol didn't work) and so it should be ended.

Just because you can have a crackdown/war on something... doesn't mean it's logical or even that you should do it. Wisemen know that you don't make moves simply because you can or it's available (you have to think of the reactions before you strike)... you make the best move rather than making any open move possible. In this case the best move is not to strike or not to have a false war (which basically boils downto another useless bureaucracy that needs a continued problem to justify it's existence and expenditures so that a few people can have cushy jobs. Oh and if that problem doesn't spread... then they won't get more/increased funding). If you move without thinking... you will more then likely lose.

[Gennocyde]

i'll get straight to the point NO! :cool: